StarCrack AI Official 6.0 Feedback Thread

[Pleomax]

Btw guys how can you counter mass carriers ?;\ I head in the last patch is easyer because you won't be able to target the interceptors.But dont want to update to the last version be cause everyone says it has some video problems.

[wombat-]

Very good job on the AI, I really enjoy playing against it.

I have a suggestion for improving your Zerg AI: It should build an additional hatchery in its main base at some point, as it won't be able to keep up with the other races production pace otherwise. I think this is the reason, why the cheating Zerg AI is significantly easier than the cheating Protoss and Terran AI's, which are the only ones I couldn't beat yet 1v1 (no cheese!). Anyone else experienced this difference in difficulty?

Also, I experienced the following: PvP, AI had like 12 Zealots chasing 8 of mine, my Zealots were forming kind of like a line while retreating. At my base I was like what the heck and decided to fight. Turned out his Zealots were focused on the single one that was on at the end of my "string" of Zealots, so I microed it back, they continued to follow it for like 4-5 seconds which gave my other Zealots time to deal enough damage to offset the AI's advantage.

Keep up the great work!

PS: Can anyone tell me where to get more maps from? Cheers.

[onimusha1985]

Also, on the Lost Temple map, the AI (at least the one protoss build) never built ANY air units other than observers.  So they couldn't attack my island bases.

But otherwise, good job.

LOL wtf ? i lost to mass carriers: D  i need check later maybe i lost vs cheating ai, not standard but dont think so, first toss atacked me whit cca 6 carriers, i killed them, then 2nd toss  come whit even more and voids : ))

btw i play only on fastest

yep i lost against carriers too lolz. like 12-15 of them. Was doing fine before they came. I hate how u attack the intercepters. THAT needs to be fixed

[onimusha1985]

Btw guys how can you counter mass carriers ?;\ I head in the last patch is easyer because you won't be able to target the interceptors.But dont want to update to the last version be cause everyone says it has some video problems.

where did u hear this? i hope they fix it so u dont attack intercepters over carriers.

[[mrn]]

Just.. sh*t, I can't beat this I'm kinda new to SC2 anyways, so could someone give me some life saving tips how to survive as protoss..?

DEVS YOU ARE DOING GREAT JOB HERE!

[R41n]

Also, on the Lost Temple map, the AI (at least the one protoss build) never built ANY air units other than observers.  So they couldn't attack my island bases.

Well i don;t know what happened in your game but here is the story of my first defeat with AI v.6:

I played a lost temple and i was P and the AI was 1Z&2P.I was trying to beat the computer with only 10 workers(like nipels said above  ).The first wave was from zerg and with a little luck i managed to escape with half of my army(zels and stalks) .Short after the attack i sent some zels and stalks to wipe him(the zerg) but i fail  .Right after i attacked him a P comp managed to destroy him.I sayd wow, 2 more to go.But as i was enjoying the defeat of the zerg, after a few minutes a massive army of zealots, stalkers and some immortals was at my door .I was having only 1 expansion and was guarded by ~15 zealots,~8 stalkers and 3 immortals and some cannons.He was crushing me but i escaped and i settled on the north island.There i managed to get ~10 pheonix, 8 cannons&stalkers for defense, and over 12 void rays.Meanwhile a protoss player wiped out the other P with over 10 (i think) carriers(i was having some observers and i saw the fight).Then after 2 minutes(he was searching the map looking for me ) he finally find me and i was having the same fate as the poor P comp .

This V6.0 is much better than the last version.
Its very funny and i im looking further for the next games as i im playing with a limit of workers and is very challenging .

[Pleomax]

Just.. sh*t, I can't beat this I'm kinda new to SC2 anyways, so could someone give me some life saving tips how to survive as protoss..?

DEVS YOU ARE DOING GREAT JOB HERE!

http://forums.battle.net/thread.html?topicId=23393189396&sid=5000

http://www.starcraft2.com/features/battlereports/1.xml
http://www.starcraft2.com/features/battlereports/2.xml
http://www.starcraft2.com/features/battlereports/3.xml
http://www.starcraft2.com/features/battlereports/4.xml

The battle reports are verry enjoyable. Hope this helps you.
Maybe devs can get some ideeas on how to improve the AI from thoes reports !

[Crazed]

Just tried the cheating AI, it has improved a little bit, though it seems that you've programmed it to be more proactive than reactive (ie. if the T is set on going marine/hellion, its gonna do that, regardless of whether I went with no zeals or lings, then of course it does the opposite, when I mass lings it doesnt include any hellions in its army composition).

Of course the same old problem exists: if I survive the early game (ie. I don't die to the 24 zeal rush, or the M/M rush, I pretty much outmacro the AI, which if it has unlimited APM and a shitload more resources should not be possible).

And yea, if you do exploit bugs in the AI such as kiting units around you'll win, its like using your worker in SC1 to attack an enemy building and have the AI's peons chase you around. I'd recommend that if you're losing to the AI, not to build more static D, but to improve macro and army composition so that when SC2 comes out you won't have any bad habits spilling over into your games against human players.

[notquitefob]

been following the starcrack AI development and was able to upgrade from 5.5 to 6 last night.  First, I just want to say that this is definitely a noticeable improvement over 5.5 in terms of difficulty. 


Lost Temple: I was using Terran v. 1xZ, 1xP, 1xT. 


The zerg first came at me early-mid game with 20+ lings and roaches that I was able to fend off with turtling, bunkers and repairing SCV.  Right after I killed them off the Zerg computer announced GG because apparently it got wiped out by another comp while attacking me.


Then the second wave came from the Toss with 10 Zealots, 5 stalkers, 2 immortals.  By now I had 3 BCs which I was able to hold them after they took out my first expansion. 


By the time I hit 8 BCs I went hunting.  Unfortunately, just as I reached the Toss base, my base was attacked by 4 BCs, squad of Vikings, and several tanks.  By the time I got back to my base, most of my defenses were wiped out, but luckily few more BCs came out and backup arrived. 


I then took my 10 BCs out to counter and ran into mass Carriers.  The only thing that saved me was that Y-cannon finished researching halfway out of base and was able to fend off the Carriers but leaving my BCs crippled.  I shuttled several SCVs onto a plateau to repair my BCs and reinforced the group with 3 more BCs from base while frantically trying to fortify my expansion.


After reaching the Toss base, I saw that the other Terran computer also arrived with several BCs.  With the Toss in disarray, I engaged the Terran computer head on with SCV repairing, and Y-cannons firing.  Took a huge attrition hit after combat but survived with 4 barely flying BCs being repaired.  Ended up winning shortly after this.


Notes on what they did better this in 6.0
1. cannons near mineral patches to prevent backdoor attacks
2. stronger early-mid game and mix of units
3. computers more willing to stick it out when attacking rather than opting to retreat most of the time.  this allowed multiple computers to wear me down over time rather than allowing me to keep fortifying my base due to retreating enemies.


Notes on why I thought I was able to win:


1. computers didn't use Y-cannon on me, it was the only thing that gave me an edge in battle.
2. computers didn't attack SCVs when they repair bunkers and BCs.
3. computers didn't use much cloaking/abilities to their advantage
4. FFA.  They attacked each other.  If this was co-op against me, I would've gotten owned


Overall, great improvement over 5.x.  I think the difficulty is just right for me right now as I get more use to the game.  Going to play a few more before upping the game speed as I'm still on "normal" speed right now.  Will update as I log more time on the AI.

[DemonStalker]

Terran vs. Protoss isn't even funny.  You can harass with 3-4 Reapers all game, and the AI will be stuck with Zealots and Stalkers (though I did see 1 High Templar), while you mass Battlecruisers.

For some reason, it won't build a Photon Cannon at its main base's mineral field (but it does at expos).  Also, Stalkers won't blink, so my Reapers can just jump a cliff and be safe. 

Edit:  Although I believe that my constant harassing stopped him from researching Blink.  Maybe put essential upgrades as a higher priority than just building more units?

[cyricc]

This AI is fun and it builds a lot more than 5.5 but it just isn't any fun winning over and over again just because I survive the first rush and due to the fact that the AI doesn't care whether it wins or loses. That's pretty much guaranteed in this AI. Survive the first rush, keep building what you are and you will win. I suppose that it will only get better with time but I have a different suggestion. Why not drop the AI projects, as it seems that they have kinda hit an apex, and pick up the server emulation project? I think this is more of the direction that the devs should take since its what we all really want anyway.

[wombat-]

i changed a few things and found that the (cheating Terran) AI, which i havnt been able to beat before now, has gotten very easy all of a sudden:

used Lazylauncher v2 isntead of the original one
used the 1.2.2 GUI instead od none
used the maps from the map thread on this board instead of another one i dont remember where i got it from (mappack created by "omnipotent" , is what it says in the readme)
changed gameplay speed settings normal --> faster


will reverse each of these options 1 for one to check wich one affected difficulty.

EDIT: just noticed that on startup it says starcrack v5.5 which explains the drop in difficulty  ...   how did the before mentioned changes affect cause the AI to revert to 5.5 wtf?

[paco]

Just did ffa map against t,z whatever the 3rd was what they took out.
There isn't much difference except Z was sending its overlords after my DTs and comp used the corner expansions on LT. Still it both got assraped easily.
Terran had like 1 scan before i took out its entire base with dts...

[turdburgler]

i changed a few things and found that the (cheating Terran) AI, which i havnt been able to beat before now, has gotten very easy all of a sudden:

used Lazylauncher v2 isntead of the original one
used the 1.2.2 GUI instead od none
used the maps from the map thread on this board instead of another one i dont remember where i got it from (mappack created by "omnipotent" , is what it says in the readme)
changed gameplay speed settings normal --> faster


will reverse each of these options 1 for one to check wich one affected difficulty.

EDIT: just noticed that on startup it says starcrack v5.5 which explains the drop in difficulty  ...   how did the before mentioned changes affect cause the AI to revert to 5.5 wtf?

Make sure you haven't got a TriggerLibs folder inside StarCraft II Beta folder, if you do, delete it. Then install V6.0 Again.

[wombat-]

you should not use lazylauncher2 GUI 1.2.2 as of now, as it does the following:

-GUI can detect your SC2 directory and replace the AI file

(which is still 5.5)