Discuss.
I am so excited. I can hardly wait for this to drop. Thanks so much!
ETA pl0x? ;D
Sounds great, cant wait!
This sounds almost too good to be true... I honestly can't wait to try this out!
Can't wait for this, you have the best AI out right now,can wait to test this one.
thanks for all your hard work ;D
Best AI ever, can't wait.
should be good
btw... did you burgle my turd earlier? i dropped a deuce and went to get my camera for evidence and then it was gone ???
Quote from: killabyte on March 03, 2010, 10:07:53 PM
should be good
btw... did you burgle my turd earlier? i dropped a deuce and went to get my camera for evidence and then it was gone ???
I steal so many each day it's honestly a blur. If I was there, a UV light will reveal my calling card. ;)
I can't wait for the 6.0!!!!! Please release it as it is now, as a version 5.6 or something, and release it when its completed as v 6.0 :D
Cannot wait for V6.. I' was back and forth with v5.5 w/cheats until i discovered that if you hold off their unnatural early game production.. then its game over. So definitely excited for this.
Make a beta with only 1 variant :P I can't wait when it's sounds so brilliant... :D
Why not release 5.9 for now or something? We dont mind. Hehe.
i`m looking forward to try it:).. i`m so sick of v5.5 .. is very dumb.. i have managed to kill all 5 AI-s only with 3 v-ray (protoss)... :-[
Quote from: matrixn on March 03, 2010, 10:12:01 PM
i`m looking forward to try it:).. i`m so sick of v5.5 .. is very dumb.. i have managed to kill all 5 AI-s only with 3 v-ray (protoss)... :-[
5 AI-s with only 3 void rays? That's 5 counts of 1v1's you're saying right? I don't remember being able to do so vs 5 at once. Unless you mean defend your base and just send out 3 void rays.
By the way, i think i saw a sc2 "mod" somewhere on the web, that lets you be a observer after defeat. Anyone know's where to download that?
It would help, if i want to see how the ai's play, so i can rate the mod more accurate.
wooooot 2 thumps up for the big boys!!!!!!!.....
6.0 will be so much more fun and now i can really test my skill by the sounds of it i just hope the AI micro wont run by your army if its trap and your army size is bigger and also terrain dont repair be nice if they did cause i baeling rushed the command center it had like 150-200hp left and i was making more units at my base then the AI said gg and hes command center blow up....lol but V5,5 is still really fun to play with thnxs for your hard work/// cant wait to try 6.0 Thnxs
I tried 5.0/5.1 hardest cpu mods but it's not a big deal to beat any comp.
If you are with terran and simply lock your base down with supplys the AI often retreats even before it could destroy 1 layer of the wall.
If you are with toss and make DTs the ai usually blows the scans from 1 CC and then it gets fucked because does not make detectors.
All the old tank drops still working, its really rare that the AI would send anything against the tanks.
If the comp has fuckloads of units and attacks you but you attack his base in the meantime it will pull back all the troops. If you drop tanks, other units then pick them up again the AI won't even try to get your dropships just goes back to normal.
tuche`: "Unless you mean defend your base and just send out 3 void rays."
I wanted to see what is capable of w-ray and.. for my surprise.. i killed everything with only fuckin 3 wrays :D :D
Thanks for your work on this guys. I have been using Starcrack since v3. I will give you some feedback when I play against V6.
Again, thank you so much for this guys.
awesome news!
now having said that, i hope that you've gotten the time to address the micro of the units (ie. the scout/army moving back and forth when they see the t1 units/stronger army).
i hope that the new early/mid/late BO's will be able to mesh well together. again, i believe the early bo's are highly important so it is best to just implement std efficient opens (so we can't overrun with our 1st wave vs AI. coupled with an efficient open and decent micro, they may be able to withstand the 1st rush which would be a DEFINITE milestone) and add some variable techs (ie. immortals, banshees, etc). the bo's should be cohesive enough and implement good unit mixes rather than random. i'd love to have a.i. that could counter our unit mix (probably hard to implement).
another thing to implement is the use of warp gates, phase prisms, proxies, nydus worms, burrowed roaches/infestors, medivac+thor drops, etc. as a.i. improves (some may already be implemented? ive yet to see anything technically astute abt the a.i. as i've never been past 12-15 mins, however, blink micro is awesome!).
i believe the current a.i. don't employ overseers or at least dont micro them well? observers are pretty key too and as a.i. gets better, perhaps that can be one element to aid a.i. in countering our unit mixes (ie. we have too many roaches so comp makes immortals, etc).
the cheating a.i. should be adjustable, b/cuz strats that distrupt mineral lines are vastly undermined.
w/ total saturation, will a.i. be able to keep up macro-wise? i suppose the easiest way to good a.i. are improvements to macro. that way at least they have the unit count and can rely on the chokes to hold ground. if they learned to wall w/ T that would be gosu if that were somehow available (map dependant).
btw, if a.i. can repair structures as stated above, that would be key. also the use of the chrono boost, mule, inject larvae, as well as the non-traditional macro skills that each race possess (ie. the structure heal and creep tumor from zerg, etc). again, may have been implemented, but just want to help a.i. macro-wise.
First of all, thanks for all the work you guys have done. We all really appreciate it. I'm really looking forward to version 6.0, especially if the AI starts defending its expansions lol.
Also, will there be a way (eventually) to save replays of the matches against the AI? I really suck against the AI, because the early game push is very hard (for me) to defend, and I'd like to see what the AI is doing to get so many units so early in the game. Seriously, if I'm playing ZvP and I 6pool, by the time my first lings get to his main the computer has like 3 zealots waiting for me. If I don't go 9pool every game I get overrun so quickly ;_;
Jeus christ, i don't wanna discuss, so, stfu, i just wanna say thank you to yall ;)
v6.0 sounds very uber! Ily Turdburgler, I can't wait.
Quote from: GrizzlyAdam on March 03, 2010, 10:45:29 PM
First of all, thanks for all the work you guys have done. We all really appreciate it. I'm really looking forward to version 6.0, especially if the AI starts defending its expansions lol.
Also, will there be a way (eventually) to save replays of the matches against the AI? I really suck against the AI, because the early game push is very hard (for me) to defend, and I'd like to see what the AI is doing to get so many units so early in the game. Seriously, if I'm playing ZvP and I 6pool, by the time my first lings get to his main the computer has like 3 zealots waiting for me. If I don't go 9pool every game I get overrun so quickly ;_;
i dont know about u but i can watch replays of my fights just open starcraft 2 beta and click recent replays and thous are all your 1v1 matchs....
Really? Dang. Mine aren't there. I guess I need to do a clean install of the game. I'm still using all the original replay cracks and whatnot from before sandbox mode was released. Thanks for telling me though :)
now SIR TURD is threatening...wooo cant wait for the new AI..to get my hands on..
thanks sir for the work you are sharing with us
glade to help i wish i knew how i did it or i could tell u step by step but it just works for me i didnt notthing to make it work that way just saves my replays after i kill my AI click return to starcraft menu maybe that will save your replay if not i tryed...
Thank you for your hard work, Turd. I am really looking forward to this challenge! Keep it up! Words can't fully express my appreciation!
Edit: So excited I almost forgot how to type!
sounds amazing, great job on this guys
I hope you don't mind me asking...
-Is there some kind of a handling script for every unit, or nothing this complex?
-Is the AI capable of reactive play? I mean, it can choose one of the 3 builds that would be best suited to deal with my strategy, or something like that.
-Will it react to nuke warnings?
Very specific micro and counter functions will likely take a couple of more versions, I'm not part of the team myself. I have been watching progress from the beginning, and let me say that v6 is a very important and very big step in the right direction.
Blizz isn't a stupid company and they clearly knew that the minute SC2 beta hit the web, the crackers would get to work. Also since its intended to test multiplayer content they want to discourage players with beta keys from facing AI. Best way to do that? Squash the AI, and make it fail.
A complete re-write of the entire AI is the only way to get what we want because Blizzard did not include full AI, also they likely have not even completed it fully, and are waiting to see what strategy develops in beta, and incorporate that into AI.
It will take several more versions to perfect the AI, but the devs are making very fast progress, so everyone keep your pants on.
I love you guys so much it isn't even funny. Like, if we were to meet in real life... and I somehow happened to know what you look like, to identify you... depending on the state we were in, certain statutes just might be broken.
On a serious note, two questions: 1) offensive bunkers? 2) warp-in, especially offensive warp-in? Can the AI do either in 6.0, and if not, is there hope for these kind of things in the future?
Quote from: p.W on March 04, 2010, 12:27:27 AM
I love you guys so much it isn't even funny... depending on the state we were in, certain statutes just might be broken.
lol
Big thanks to you AI gurus!
man All you guys are awesome I wish I could help but I have no idea how... BETTER AI FTW
let's release a beta, version 6.0 beta, open beta, without a key requirement...
Jeez, the update sounds like it's gonna offer a LOT more than 5.5. I'm not gonna raise my hopes TOO much though. I mean, only 0.5 versions earlier, I could just use stalkers the entire game and win easy. Heck, I played Zerg just recently for the first time and beat 5 comps to shit with only cracklings (and some banelings early).
can't wait for version 6.0, i barely beat 3 pc's on 5.5 Unsupported (but 2 of them were attacking themselves.
Quote from: wc3ard on March 03, 2010, 10:18:50 PM
By the way, i think i saw a sc2 "mod" somewhere on the web, that lets you be a observer after defeat. Anyone know's where to download that?
It would help, if i want to see how the ai's play, so i can rate the mod more accurate.
After your match you can watch the replay...much better than being an observer.. :P You can view all aspects of the game.
Wow. Just read the update about 6.0
Honestly, I'm really awful at this game and I kind of didn't remember. The old Easy AI that everyone has in their Launchers, is of course, too fraking easy. Even the medium is easy. for some reason 5.5 (no cheating) is just really hard to me. I can't imagine 6.0 being harder. The AI just constantly throws units while simultaneously building and expanding, and I cant keep up lol. I really suck at Starcraft haha.
Quote from: cory1234 on March 04, 2010, 01:29:36 AM
Quote from: wc3ard on March 03, 2010, 10:18:50 PM
By the way, i think i saw a sc2 "mod" somewhere on the web, that lets you be a observer after defeat. Anyone know's where to download that?
It would help, if i want to see how the ai's play, so i can rate the mod more accurate.
After your match you can watch the replay...much better than being an observer.. :P You can view all aspects of the game.
The scouts are fairly dumb..if you block the entrance they run away and keep coming back. Also I have never seen the computer use air...
The AI has a long way to go..but I have faith in you :) While it is still easy to beat 3 computers, it is much better than the original.
Will you have some documentation with your new functions and such? That would be bad ass.
can't wait for TERRIBLE, TERRIBLE DAMAGE!!
Quote from: Enox on March 04, 2010, 01:31:01 AM
Wow. Just read the update about 6.0
Honestly, I'm really awful at this game and I kind of didn't remember. The old Easy AI that everyone has in their Launchers, is of course, too fraking easy. Even the medium is easy. for some reason 5.5 (no cheating) is just really hard to me. I can't imagine 6.0 being harder. The AI just constantly throws units while simultaneously building and expanding, and I cant keep up lol. I really suck at Starcraft haha.
Keep in mind that players that consider the AIs very easy are most likely using a lot of tricks that exploit the AI's (lack of) intelligence. Not "on purpose" but because these exploits are standard gaming against human opponents. Walls, harassing units, and ranged units in general are all things the AI is ill-equipped to deal with.
But if you're a newbie playing Terran and don't know how to build a proper Terran wall, let alone if you don't even know what a Terran wall is... it's only natural that you're gonna have a LOT more trouble.
Great job peeps, can't wait for v6.0!
I am very excited. Can't wait to play against this AI. O and btw, I don't exploit the AI. It is still easy. Don't start calling out people that are good as only being able to beat the AI through exploits. Some of us are just good.
release it right away please :D
I MIGHT be exploting. I'm not sure. I build a gateway/forge wall at my ramp with 1 square open so my units can go in and out. The enemy does the back and forth thing there, so I may be exploiting. Any clarification if I am?
Quote from: orbb24 on March 04, 2010, 01:58:17 AM
I am very excited. Can't wait to play against this AI. O and btw, I don't exploit the AI. It is still easy. Don't start calling out people that are good as only being able to beat the AI through exploits. Some of us are just good.
Did you even read what I said? The 'not "on purpose"' bit? The AI cannot deal with certain parts of the game as well as other parts. When it comes to dealing with harassment, expansion denial, and kiting, the AI is plain stupid. It's not a competent player's fault for taking advantage of those things, because by the standard of regular games they're not taking advantage of anything, they're just playing the game the way it's meant to be played.
Tell me, when you play T vs P/Z AI, do you submerge your depots all the time and let the enemy run into your base? Or do you keep a couple of Marines standing nearby to get free shots off as the enemy closes and retreats? Just wondering. :)
QuoteI MIGHT be exploting. I'm not sure. I build a gateway/forge wall at my ramp with 1 square open so my units can go in and out. The enemy does the back and forth thing there, so I may be exploiting. Any clarification if I am?
If by virtue of this "trick" you keep the AI from getting inside your base, then yeah. Note again I'm not making any judgements at all, and my use of the word 'exploit' seems to be carrying a negative connotation I didn't intend. It's completely natural to keep doing whatever's working.
Can't wait for this release, keep up the good work guys!!
Quote from: p.W on March 04, 2010, 02:07:06 AMQuote from: Artanis186I MIGHT be exploting. I'm not sure. I build a gateway/forge wall at my ramp with 1 square open so my units can go in and out. The enemy does the back and forth thing there, so I may be exploiting. Any clarification if I am?
If by virtue of this "trick" you keep the AI from getting inside your base, then yeah. Note again I'm not making any judgements at all, and my use of the word 'exploit' seems to be carrying a negative connotation I didn't intend. It's completely natural to keep doing whatever's working.
I knew what you intended, I took no offense to it. I'm just curious if the exploiting is the ONLY reason I'm winning.
(http://img294.imageshack.us/img294/5318/screenshot005xm.th.jpg) (http://img294.imageshack.us/i/screenshot005xm.jpg/)
Here's my usual base entrance. There's also usually a few zealots and maybe some stalkers there too. My units can fit through that bottom slot below the gateway
Quote from: Enox on March 04, 2010, 01:31:01 AM
Wow. Just read the update about 6.0
Honestly, I'm really awful at this game and I kind of didn't remember. The old Easy AI that everyone has in their Launchers, is of course, too fraking easy. Even the medium is easy. for some reason 5.5 (no cheating) is just really hard to me. I can't imagine 6.0 being harder. The AI just constantly throws units while simultaneously building and expanding, and I cant keep up lol. I really suck at Starcraft haha.
Keep challenging yourself and you'll get better before you know it! If you're having a really hard time, try a lower version to get your morale up. The key to any RTS game is multi-tasking and understanding your tech / units. Starting making groups (by highlighting and pressing SHIFT+#) and practice multi-tasking. You can bind a building to it's own group if you want too (I do that for my Hatchery because I play Zerg).
PM me if you want some pointers - I may not be an awesomeleetnessauce player, but I'm willing to help you out. :)
Edit: Oh yea, and if you're having a hard time it might be because you can't choose your race for your games, so you may be busy trying to learn all of the races. Just press F10, and "Restart" untill you get the race you want to learn first.
Quote from: Artanis186 on March 04, 2010, 02:21:44 AMQuote from: p.W on March 04, 2010, 02:07:06 AMQuote from: Artanis186I MIGHT be exploting. I'm not sure. I build a gateway/forge wall at my ramp with 1 square open so my units can go in and out. The enemy does the back and forth thing there, so I may be exploiting. Any clarification if I am?[/size][/font]
If by virtue of this "trick" you keep the AI from getting inside your base, then yeah. Note again I'm not making any judgements at all, and my use of the word 'exploit' seems to be carrying a negative connotation I didn't intend. It's completely natural to keep doing whatever's working.
I knew what you intended, I took no offense to it. I'm just curious if the exploiting is the ONLY reason I'm winning.
(http://img294.imageshack.us/img294/5318/screenshot005xm.th.jpg) (http://img294.imageshack.us/i/screenshot005xm.jpg/)
Here's my usual base entrance. There's also usually a few zealots and maybe some stalkers there too. My units can fit through that bottom slot below the gateway
Very easy to check. Play a game and don't do it.
I know I have a lot of trouble holding off the first Zerg rush if I don't set up a wall. I
can do it, but have never fully recovered from that and gone on to beat the AI.
Awesome! The dancing army stuff is making me want to kill myself.
Quote from: Sandwich on March 04, 2010, 02:29:01 AM
Awesome! The dancing army stuff is making me want to kill myself.
Damn, talk about taking a game too seriously.
Quote from: p.W on March 04, 2010, 01:52:39 AM
Quote from: Enox on March 04, 2010, 01:31:01 AM
Wow. Just read the update about 6.0
Honestly, I'm really awful at this game and I kind of didn't remember. The old Easy AI that everyone has in their Launchers, is of course, too fraking easy. Even the medium is easy. for some reason 5.5 (no cheating) is just really hard to me. I can't imagine 6.0 being harder. The AI just constantly throws units while simultaneously building and expanding, and I cant keep up lol. I really suck at Starcraft haha.
Keep in mind that players that consider the AIs very easy are most likely using a lot of tricks that exploit the AI's (lack of) intelligence. Not "on purpose" but because these exploits are standard gaming against human opponents. Walls, harassing units, and ranged units in general are all things the AI is ill-equipped to deal with.
But if you're a newbie playing Terran and don't know how to build a proper Terran wall, let alone if you don't even know what a Terran wall is... it's only natural that you're gonna have a LOT more trouble.
Thanks everyone for your advice. I used to play SC1 off and on, and i've been able to play Toss and Terran usually. Never been a Zerg player at all so yeah when its set to random and i get them i really just try to mass Zerglings (upgrades of course)
But you know what I found out? I was playing the 5.5 with Cheating...haha whoops. I was getting constant constant flows of Zerg units coming into my base, like...never ending. Normal 5.5 not so much the same problem haha. I can create a bomb terran defense that can't be penetrated. It's just moving out onto them when i get Zerg swarmed. But yeah, it was all custom 5.5 that was killing me haha.
Quote from: p.W on March 04, 2010, 02:07:06 AM
Quote from: orbb24 on March 04, 2010, 01:58:17 AM
I am very excited. Can't wait to play against this AI. O and btw, I don't exploit the AI. It is still easy. Don't start calling out people that are good as only being able to beat the AI through exploits. Some of us are just good.
Did you even read what I said? The 'not "on purpose"' bit? The AI cannot deal with certain parts of the game as well as other parts. When it comes to dealing with harassment, expansion denial, and kiting, the AI is plain stupid. It's not a competent player's fault for taking advantage of those things, because by the standard of regular games they're not taking advantage of anything, they're just playing the game the way it's meant to be played.
Tell me, when you play T vs P/Z AI, do you submerge your depots all the time and let the enemy run into your base? Or do you keep a couple of Marines standing nearby to get free shots off as the enemy closes and retreats? Just wondering. :)
I did read the post. You said it MAY be unintentional. Implying others probably are doing the intentional ones such as 8 scvs on a bunker. And since you are "just wondering" I only wall in when I play against the cheating AI. Against the normal 5.5 I don't wall in because that would be exploiting it. With the cheating AI though you have to use that exploit or else you are just going to get over run. Nothing you can really do about that. And I am sorry for making it such a big deal. It just seemed like you were acting like one of those people who think others only have an easy time because they have to exploit and in no way could just be good. See way to many of those people so I just assumed you were another. Sorry about that if you aren't trying to act like that.
Quote from: p.W on March 04, 2010, 02:24:45 AMVery easy to check. Play a game and don't do it.
I know I have a lot of trouble holding off the first Zerg rush if I don't set up a wall. I can do it, but have never fully recovered from that and gone on to beat the AI.
Well, I tested... but idt I can really count that test successfully. See, i apparently did a 3-way ffa with the comps. Well, Zerg 1 came in, killed a buncha my probes and I managed to fend em off. Then... the Terran came in. I barely held out with them. Then the Zerg came back with Roaches and I was lost. This was all sequential, 0 break from the waves. Happened 1 after another RIGHT when I fended them off. I'll try it out on a 1v1 next time, maybe my chances of success will increase. :)
Quote- Expansion managing functions (defences, etc)
That's a tough one, the actual defense depends if you want to make it more realistic or more challenging. Most players don't actually build a lot of defenses at each expansion, they rely on strategy and rally of their troops to where they are needed. But this of course relies on planning ahead and expansion placement. In your case to prevent cheesing the AI, it might be more beneficial to have the AI place more building defense (cannons/bunkers/crawlers). This is because the AI would have a tough time choosing where and how to defend and for it to less likely string attacks. For example if it goes to defend a far away expansion, I'll just go attack its main.
Quote- New custom AI attack functions (resource harrasing, constant pressure on the player)
Drops? I think this really is a key strategy that the AI could really abuse players on, especially newbies. I think SC2 it's less effective (so far), but would keep players on their toes. The only other attack functions I could immediately think of, or rather strategy, is containing the player. This was HUGE in SC, especially for Terran. But SC2 introduces more mobile units and especially units such as the reaper and colossus that can scale the level. So it may be more effective if you just put pressure on the opponent's expansions.
Quote- 3 new opens, mid and late games for every race. (Which means 27 different variations per race and 81 overall)
Nice, nice, and nice. Variety is everything in this game. Once something (or someone) gets predictable the game will get old fast. Thanks for all your continued hard work on this AI, and I look forward to testing it out. You're fucking awesome.
Quote from: Artanis186 on March 04, 2010, 02:43:59 AMmaybe my chances of success will increase. :)
And maybe not... apparently sYk0 screwed up the maps and the 1v1 had 2 AI in it... Well, I messaged him about it and I'll await updated maps (I can't LIVE without his ones with loading screens. ;o)
An easy mode in v6.0!? Finally! :D I'm a total noob and can hardly handle the normal AI. Thanks for including an easy mode! :)
Quote from: p.W on March 04, 2010, 02:24:45 AMVery easy to check. Play a game and don't do it.
I know I have a lot of trouble holding off the first Zerg rush if I don't set up a wall. I can do it, but have never fully recovered from that and gone on to beat the AI.
Good news. :) I actually beat em without the blocking. It wasn't nearly as easy, but I did it. :D </confidence boost>
I've played over 10,000 games of starcraft and I'm a semi-pro SC gamer so this new AI is exciting me quite a lot. The ones we've got now I beat while sleeping. I can literally micro 20 lings and 5 roaches for 20 minutes vs the ai (ofc at which point i've got like 5 expansions and full tech :P). Why don't you just release the AI and update it after? I'm sure 90% of the people here would rather have this artificial goodness ASAP over the finished version at the high quality you're seeking. Just call it like 5.9 and when it's where you expected it to be, release it as 6.0. I know this makes the jumps smaller and less awe-inspiring but I don't think that's what you guys are going for :P.
It's fine with whatever you AI dev's decide, thanks for the great and speedy work. I guess if I've been waiting 5 years for SC2, I can stand to wait another few days for an improved AI for it :).
Quote from: sLayed on March 04, 2010, 04:34:24 AM
I've played over 10,000 games of starcraft and I'm a semi-pro SC gamer so this new AI is exciting me quite a lot. The ones we've got now I beat while sleeping. I can literally micro 20 lings and 5 roaches for 20 minutes vs the ai (ofc at which point i've got like 5 expansions and full tech :P ). Why don't you just release the AI and update it after? I'm sure 90% of the people here would rather have this artificial goodness ASAP over the finished version at the high quality you're seeking. Just call it like 5.9 and when it's where you expected it to be, release it as 6.0. I know this makes the jumps smaller and less awe-inspiring but I don't think that's what you guys are going for :P .
It's fine with whatever you AI dev's decide, thanks for the great and speedy work. I guess if I've been waiting 5 years for SC2, I can stand to wait another few days for an improved AI for it :) .
5 expos full tech? how do u macro effectively? it's hardly manageable w/ 2 fully saturated bases as i've seen in multiplayer reps. also, how do u manage to get 5 expos? were u testing out the tech tree? btw, whats ur apm?
I want to say that version 5.5 (non cheating) was an incredibly stupid AI. The CPU is only going back and forth it's like clikcing forward then clicking backward, zig-zag. You could just place a few tanks there and kill him while he's zig-zaging. Then you mass untis and rape him, seriously stupid CPU. Make sure that the new AI will actually attack you until dead and form at least 50 units before attacking you at a time.
Look - you block your entrance and your enemy will be trying to enter but dying. How about getting mutalisk atatcks and air attacks from behind attacking your workers? Can CPU 6.0 do this?
is this starcrack ai really "crack"? it becomes much more than small twick/hack "tool".
is there any chance to make this ai official and maybe then rebrand the title from "crack"?
Quote from: katalonec on March 04, 2010, 05:22:58 AM
is this starcrack ai really "crack"? it becomes much more than small twick/hack "tool".
is there any chance to make this ai official and maybe then rebrand the title from "crack"?
i believe it's the dev team's name lol
Quote from: r3ddrag0nx on March 04, 2010, 05:46:36 AM
Quote from: katalonec on March 04, 2010, 05:22:58 AM
is this starcrack ai really "crack"? it becomes much more than small twick/hack "tool".
is there any chance to make this ai official and maybe then rebrand the title from "crack"?
i believe it's the dev team's name lol
sure why not ;)
Quote from: sLayed on March 04, 2010, 04:34:24 AM
I've played over 10,000 games of starcraft and I'm a semi-pro SC gamer so this new AI is exciting me quite a lot.
I'm not sure any AI can be a challenge on its own to a good player. Your best hope is to team up several AIs against you if you want a challenge. If we can find a way to specify teams from the MapInfo file this would be possible.
turdburgler, did i get that right, you can now easily add any number of tactics for any race and any phase of the game (modular)
if so, can the AI switch tactics mid-game if they see that they may fail ?
Quote from: sLayed on March 04, 2010, 04:34:24 AM
I've played over 10,000 games of starcraft and I'm a semi-pro SC gamer so this new AI is exciting me quite a lot. The ones we've got now I beat while sleeping. I can literally micro 20 lings and 5 roaches for 20 minutes vs the ai (ofc at which point i've got like 5 expansions and full tech :P ). Why don't you just release the AI and update it after? I'm sure 90% of the people here would rather have this artificial goodness ASAP over the finished version at the high quality you're seeking. Just call it like 5.9 and when it's where you expected it to be, release it as 6.0. I know this makes the jumps smaller and less awe-inspiring but I don't think that's what you guys are going for :P .
It's fine with whatever you AI dev's decide, thanks for the great and speedy work. I guess if I've been waiting 5 years for SC2, I can stand to wait another few days for an improved AI for it :) .
What was your SC name? Or your iccup account? just curious
Also thank you for making v6
v5.5 is too easy imo
Quote from: TokeGaming on March 04, 2010, 06:42:57 AMv5.5 is too easy imo
Try playing without walling, it'll give a little bit more of a challenge cuz the AI doesn't know what to do when you wall. (Hope that'll be fixed in 6.0)
When new AI comes about?
Quote from: megasoch on March 04, 2010, 07:30:13 AM
When new AI comes about?
Ah, one of the more original, well thought out questions that noone woulda thought of before....
Anywho, it'll be done when it's done. He can't just say XX/XX/XXXX at XX:XX. It's not really a process in which you plan out everything ahead of time.
Cant wait, keep up the good work!
I still got a question. when i start sc2 i start with the double amount of everything. + when i build like 1 marine i get 2. anyone can plxxx help me how to fix this.
i probably got a file double in a map or something?
hmm i think these are some nice and major changes for improving the ai a lot! it also uses many more of the sc2 built in functions for the ai as before!! now were finally going to use the stuff that is supported by sc2! harassing and most of the changes ov v6 are not just new to the sc2 ai-scripts, but they are better than most of already published AI's.. or does someone knows an ai, which is harassing oO.. sounds very good but will be some work, and i hope we get a not that bugged version at least, when it is released!
its just pity that there is no reacting ai yet, but maybe itll be in v10 sometimes ;). gj so far!
Awesome, Can't wait Turdburgler and team! Keep up the great work!
Quote from: Tijnnn on March 04, 2010, 08:05:21 AM
Cant wait, keep up the good work!
I still got a question. when i start sc2 i start with the double amount of everything. + when i build like 1 marine i get 2. anyone can plxxx help me how to fix this.
i probably got a file double in a map or something?
Sounds like you have 2 AI mods installed, probably one in the packed format i.e.
StarCraft II\Mods\Liberty.SC2Mod\Base.SC2Data (Starcrack AI)
And one in the unpacked format, i.e.
StarCraft II\TriggerLibs\*.galaxy (Goosie AI)
I would try removing the TriggerLibs folder if you have that... maybe just cut and paste elsewhere as a backup just incase.
Nice work! This is a lot of effort, sounds so cool.
I recently wrote my own terran AI with my limited resource and time, it took me so much time even I am just editing the build order. Rewriting the micro plus 27 build orders is a really big task, can't wait to see this happen. It must be a great improvement, and give us those key-less beta testers a lot of fun before we get our bnet access.
This will be great I can't wait for it. Good job guys
Quote from: siman on March 04, 2010, 10:44:01 AM
Nice work! This is a lot of effort, sounds so cool.
I recently wrote my own terran AI with my limited resource and time, it took me so much time even I am just editing the build order. Rewriting the micro plus 27 build orders is a really big task, can't wait to see this happen. It must be a great improvement, and give us those key-less beta testers a lot of fun before we get our bnet access.
Heh, I don't know about you, but even if I get a beta key, I'll still be playing against this AI every now and then when I want a break from multiplayer. :)
Quote from: Gamewiz on March 04, 2010, 10:50:42 AM
Quote from: siman on March 04, 2010, 10:44:01 AM
Nice work! This is a lot of effort, sounds so cool.
I recently wrote my own terran AI with my limited resource and time, it took me so much time even I am just editing the build order. Rewriting the micro plus 27 build orders is a really big task, can't wait to see this happen. It must be a great improvement, and give us those key-less beta testers a lot of fun before we get our bnet access.
Heh, I don't know about you, but even if I get a beta key, I'll still be playing against this AI every now and then when I want a break from multiplayer. :)
No offense, but that is wrong. Taking a break from playing real people to play an AI? Hey man whatever works for you but as soon as I can play online I'm done with the AI.
Quote from: orbb24 on March 04, 2010, 10:56:01 AM
Quote from: Gamewiz on March 04, 2010, 10:50:42 AM
Quote from: siman on March 04, 2010, 10:44:01 AM
Nice work! This is a lot of effort, sounds so cool.
I recently wrote my own terran AI with my limited resource and time, it took me so much time even I am just editing the build order. Rewriting the micro plus 27 build orders is a really big task, can't wait to see this happen. It must be a great improvement, and give us those key-less beta testers a lot of fun before we get our bnet access.
Heh, I don't know about you, but even if I get a beta key, I'll still be playing against this AI every now and then when I want a break from multiplayer. :)
No offense, but that is wrong. Taking a break from playing real people to play an AI? Hey man whatever works for you but as soon as I can play online I'm done with the AI.
To each his own, man. Contrary to popular belief, there are many people out there who prefer AI over a human opponent. I just happen to be right in the middle. I like doing both depending on my mood. If I just want a relaxing game, I play against AI. If I want a challenge, I play against a human.
I've just read the stuff about "exploiting" the AI that goes back and forth.
The definition of "exploiting" and "walling" here is way to narrow.
I got into this bug with only 3 zerg towers (can't remember their name) and a bunch of zergling. Not even in a narrow space. But that's just a pretty obvious move, to place defences in front of your base. I wasn't trying to wall at all, it wasn't on a ramp or anything.
Also, the AI obviously see burrowed units. I tried burrowing zergling further away from my defences. I wanted to let the ai approach my defences, then use my lings to cut their retreat. But instead, the ai started turning back when they arrived on my burrowed zerglings instead of going near the defence like before (although they had no detector). And this was with NO building, and in the middle of a large area.
Obviously, the problem is not with walling. It's with the AI turning back when outpowered, and attacking again with the same unit a few second later, and turning back again and so on and so forth.
Aside from that annoying bug (such a strange comportement can only be considered a bug) I was really pleasantly surprised with the gap from the V3 to the V5.5 AI.
Not that it became really hard, but at least it now goes air, and use advanced units. Before, it would only use the basic units (zelot / stalker, nothing else).
Now it actually attacked with a bunch of carriers. That is pretty enjoyable. Not realy a challenge in 1V1, but a good warming up until the multi is actually playable.
So thanks a lot. I'm waiting for the v6 :)
Is the 5.5 easy version available for download? There's no link for it in the OP.
Quote from: lolwut on March 04, 2010, 11:37:16 AM
Is the 5.5 easy version available for download? There's no link for it in the OP.
No.
Quote from: sLayed on March 04, 2010, 04:34:24 AM
Why don't you just release the AI and update it after? I'm sure 90% of the people here would rather have this artificial goodness ASAP over the finished version at the high quality you're seeking. Just call it like 5.9 and when it's where you expected it to be, release it as 6.0. I know this makes the jumps smaller and less awe-inspiring but I don't think that's what you guys are going for :P .
It's fine with whatever you AI dev's decide, thanks for the great and speedy work. I guess if I've been waiting 5 years for SC2, I can stand to wait another few days for an improved AI for it :) .
Heh, as with every game-related update/patch/change, people can't seem to wait. Trust me, it is much better to wait for it to be completed and ready than it is to push the dev to release a buggy update. Turd did mention that he basically scrapped all of blizzard's code, right? It's a lot of hard work writing code, checking it for possible typos, testing it, changing the code again, checking it again, testing, changing, checking, testing, ect... We are getting this for free - and with out these guys cracking it, we'd still be browsing youtube and watching other people's replays. :P
(Thank you again for all your hard work Turd!)
This is the first time I'll ever say this... I love turd!
It isn't that we can't wait and must have it now. We are just excited. I wish I could have it right now but I would like it to be perfect before it is released as well. I'm sure everyone else saying things along the lines of "release is now!" also want the same. We would all rather wait a day for it to be amazing then get it now at just a step below amazing. We are just excited. I have wanted SC2 for longer then I can remember. I'm just so happy I finally have it. Again, just excitement is all.
Quote from: Nesreca on March 04, 2010, 11:56:50 AM
Quote from: sLayed on March 04, 2010, 04:34:24 AM
Why don't you just release the AI and update it after? I'm sure 90% of the people here would rather have this artificial goodness ASAP over the finished version at the high quality you're seeking. Just call it like 5.9 and when it's where you expected it to be, release it as 6.0. I know this makes the jumps smaller and less awe-inspiring but I don't think that's what you guys are going for :P .
It's fine with whatever you AI dev's decide, thanks for the great and speedy work. I guess if I've been waiting 5 years for SC2, I can stand to wait another few days for an improved AI for it :) .
Heh, as with every game-related update/patch/change, people can't seem to wait. Trust me, it is much better to wait for it to be completed and ready than it is to push the dev to release a buggy update. Turd did mention that he basically scrapped all of blizzard's code, right? It's a lot of hard work writing code, checking it for possible typos, testing it, changing the code again, checking it again, testing, changing, checking, testing, ect... We are getting this for free - and with out these guys cracking it, we'd still be browsing youtube and watching other people's replays. :P
(Thank you again for all your hard work Turd!)
I'm still watching other peoples' replays, and will continue to even if we get multiplayer.
Quote from: itsarabbit on March 04, 2010, 01:05:56 PM
I'm still watching other peoples' replays, and will continue to even if we get multiplayer.
hah..I find starcraft more interesting to watch then play..
For sc1 I played only singleplayer and watched shitloads of Korean games.
I kinda know what I should do in game but my hands and multitasking are failing me..
Quote from: itsarabbit on March 04, 2010, 01:05:56 PM
I'm still watching other peoples' replays, and will continue to even if we get multiplayer.
Yeah. What I meant is at least we have something to play with now and are able to get a head start when it comes to learning new units, hot keys, and buildings. ^_^
Yo Turdburgler that sounds like alot of build orders so I made a guide for myself awhile ago
and Ima give it to you.
http://pastebin.com/2QwT1Ufk (http://pastebin.com/2QwT1Ufk)
It just holds build orders from TeamLiquid so you dont have so sift through all the topics in their to find build orders
You really did a great job! I'm very looking forward to the 6.0 version...
I second Nesreca, thus the "back and forth-thing" the AI is fun to play against and really helps getting used to the game again. I guess 6.0 will be even more of a challenge, and beating it will give a great headstart against a whole lot of opponents once this piece of glory is released (6.0 and SC2 in general ::) )
I'd like to see 'Starcrack AI' evolving as a real alternative to Blizzards AI. I think of it as an advanced learning-tool, especially the part of the upcoming Early/Mid/End combinations.
You are awesome! Keep it up! ;D
Please release something today! Lol! If theres no release today, I kill my hamster! Hes gonna get it!
(http://www.how-to-take-care-of-a-hamster.com/hamster1.jpg)
I think what you guys are doing is great and hopefully with your efforts, Blizzard will continue to evolve their AI even after the official release, unlike the stale AI we ended up with in SC1.
I'm curious if the FFA limitation is caused by the Launcher or map, and if it's possible to team up the AI. It would of course increase the difficulty substantially. I remember reading somewhere that FFA is all we get, but I don't recall if anyone ever posted a reason.
Either way, thanks for the hard work, and I look forward to trying out 6.0.
@ImWaitingForStarcraft3 - lol that made me laugh.
But yeah just release the damn AI already. It says ETA "no not tonight", that was 3 nights ago!
I appreciate all your guys work and im only talking out of my anxious mentality. Ive waited a long time like everyone else to play this game. I knew I wasnt going to get picked for beta. Why have an opt-in if you arent being the first ones invited? We worship blizzard and they know that. Thats why they are dicking us around.
/rantdone (Again, good work and thank you for this experience!) :)
@ImWaitingForStarcraft3 ooo no he better release it today, that poor hamster shouldn't die. Thanks for providing him with incentive xD
Quote from: notquitefob on March 04, 2010, 04:49:52 PM
I'm curious if the FFA limitation is caused by the Launcher or map, and if it's possible to team up the AI. It would of course increase the difficulty substantially. I remember reading somewhere that FFA is all we get, but I don't recall if anyone ever posted a reason.
Here is the reason:Quote from: Skylo on March 02, 2010, 08:23:47 PM
Q: Why can't i choose my race, is Meele or Teambattle possible?
First, race change might implemented later, but like every other feature, devs are working on it, or might work on it when the real important work is done. Melee or Teambattles aren't yet possible cause the same reason.
Found it at: http://darkblizz.org/Forum2/ai-help-section/faq-!-()/ (http://darkblizz.org/Forum2/ai-help-section/faq-!-()/)
In short, it's the launcher. It isn't a huge issue at the moment because you can just press F10 and restart 'till you get the race you want to play. That's what I do anyways. :P
Quote from: ImWaitingforStarcraft3 on March 04, 2010, 04:25:18 PM
Please release something today! Lol! If theres no release today, I kill my hamster! Hes gonna get it!
(http://www.how-to-take-care-of-a-hamster.com/hamster1.jpg)
Great. I HATE hamsters. I want to see it die. Because of this guy, nobody gets a release today.
Feel free to thank him.
Quote from: turdburgler on March 04, 2010, 05:23:57 PM
Quote from: ImWaitingforStarcraft3 on March 04, 2010, 04:25:18 PM
Please release something today! Lol! If theres no release today, I kill my hamster! Hes gonna get it!
(http://www.how-to-take-care-of-a-hamster.com/hamster1.jpg)
Great. I HATE hamsters. I want to see it die. Because of this guy, nobody gets a release today.
Feel free to thank him.
NNNNNOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Well then, I have a sadistic treat for you, Turd.
Gerbil in a lightsocket: http://joecartoon.atom.com/cartoons/140-gerbil_in_a_light_socket (http://joecartoon.atom.com/cartoons/140-gerbil_in_a_light_socket)
Gerbil in a microwave: http://joecartoon.atom.com/cartoons/64-gerbil_in_a_microwave (http://joecartoon.atom.com/cartoons/64-gerbil_in_a_microwave)
Gerbils instead of hamsters, but who really cares? :P
aaarrrrrrggggg!!!! DUMB HAMSTER!!!!!!!!
i say u should die along with your HAMSTER cause you just made everyone wait a extra day for the greatest AI V 6,0
Starcraft 2 is the greatest game ever!!!!!!!! and u had do go around flashing your dumb Hamster GOD Im going to SICK MY CAT ON YOUR HAMSTER HE WOULD LOVE THAT FAT NASTY RAT LOOKING THING
ps... cant u just block that dumb hamster spammer from getting the new AI...hehehehe that will show him not to mess around if the Master of Cracking SC2
I kneel before u all thnxs for giving us the tools to play starcraft 2 we all feel like everyone should have a chance to play
Quote from: Swarmling on March 04, 2010, 05:39:20 PM
aaarrrrrrggggg!!!! DUMB HAMSTER!!!!!!!!
i say u should die along with your HAMSTER cause you just made everyone wait a extra day for the greatest AI V 6,0
Starcraft 2 is the greatest game ever!!!!!!!! and u had do go around flashing your dumb Hamster GOD Im going to SICK MY CAT ON YOUR HAMSTER HE WOULD LOVE THAT FAT NASTY RAT LOOKING THING
ps... cant u just block that dumb hamster spammer from getting the new AI...hehehehe that will show him not to mess around if the Master of Cracking SC2
I kneel before u all thnxs for giving us the tools to play starcraft 2 we all feel like everyone should have a chance to play
....
I think you need to go outside and take a deep breath...
Quote from: Swarmling on March 04, 2010, 05:39:20 PM
aaarrrrrrggggg!!!! DUMB HAMSTER!!!!!!!!
i say u should die along with your HAMSTER cause you just made everyone wait a extra day for the greatest AI V 6,0
Starcraft 2 is the greatest game ever!!!!!!!! and u had do go around flashing your dumb Hamster GOD Im going to SICK MY CAT ON YOUR HAMSTER HE WOULD LOVE THAT FAT NASTY RAT LOOKING THING
ps... cant u just block that dumb hamster spammer from getting the new AI...hehehehe that will show him not to mess around if the Master of Cracking SC2
I kneel before u all thnxs for giving us the tools to play starcraft 2 we all feel like everyone should have a chance to play
LOL!
WTS [Sarcasm Detector] PST!
I bet the AI wouldn't have been released tonight hamster spam or not. :P
i dont know about you guys but this 5.0 5.5 and AI seemed to be junk to me, i dont know if im using it right or if i have the right maps but these previous AI did nothing besides build a few men and come attack me then run away ALL DAY. SO i switched to Goosie's AI mod - Version 4 and what a difference. I get my maps from, http://www.nibbits.com/sc2/maps/ (http://www.nibbits.com/sc2/maps/) and i think the maps have AI on them? idk but i would unzip the Base.SC2Data to the C:\Program Files (x86)\StarCraft II Beta folder and thats it. and it seems that it does VERY little, i dont know if i need to use the maps from this site or what.is there some type of mod that needs to go with just theBase.SC2Data or just it by itself? cuz by it self it sux...
Quote from: youneedtoknow123 on March 04, 2010, 06:12:23 PM
i dont know about you guys but this 5.0 5.5 and AI seemed to be junk to me, i dont know if im using it right or if i have the right maps but these previous AI did nothing besides build a few men and come attack me then run away ALL DAY. SO i switched to Goosie's AI mod - Version 4 and what a difference. I get my maps from, http://www.nibbits.com/sc2/maps/ (http://www.nibbits.com/sc2/maps/) and i think the maps have AI on them? idk but i would unzip the Base.SC2Data to the C:\Program Files (x86)\StarCraft II Beta folder and thats it. and it seems that it does VERY little, i dont know if i need to use the maps from this site or what.is there some type of mod that needs to go with just theBase.SC2Data or just it by itself? cuz by it self it sux...
... hmmm.... username just created, first post, and he comes on here bashing one AI while promoting another. Seriously get a life.
Will it be out tomato?
lolwtfstfu, not bashing. asking. fuck face 8)
Quote from: youneedtoknow123 on March 04, 2010, 06:21:52 PM
lolwtfstfu, not bashing. asking. fuck face 8)
Get up on the wrong side of the bed this morning?
Quote from: youneedtoknow123 on March 04, 2010, 06:12:23 PM
i dont know about you guys but this 5.0 5.5 and AI seemed to be junk to me, i dont know if im using it right or if i have the right maps but these previous AI did nothing besides build a few men and come attack me then run away ALL DAY. SO i switched to Goosie's AI mod - Version 4 and what a difference. I get my maps from, http://www.nibbits.com/sc2/maps/ (http://www.nibbits.com/sc2/maps/) and i think the maps have AI on them? idk but i would unzip the Base.SC2Data to the C:\Program Files (x86)\StarCraft II Beta folder and thats it. and it seems that it does VERY little, i dont know if i need to use the maps from this site or what.is there some type of mod that needs to go with just theBase.SC2Data or just it by itself? cuz by it self it sux...
Uhm... you
are aware that the people releasing AI have been either modifying blizzard's
beta AI or writing the
whole thing from scratch right? Considering that the people in this community have been putting out AI's for only the past week, the AIs are great, and getting better every time!
um... i am aware of everything, just i have read people say stuff such as they get rushed and the AI is really good and wondering why i dont have the same experience. and am asking if im missing something. why are you guys so thick?
I hope that you will add all the "micro scripts", that are posted in the AI Dev part of the forum in the next version(no matter, if it gets delayed due to this). Also pls clean the topic after the release of ver 6.0, I don't wanna read about bugs/suggestions already fixed/added.
Quote from: 2g4u on March 04, 2010, 06:39:27 PM
I hope that you will add all the "micro scripts", that are posted in the AI Dev part of the forum in the next version(no matter, if it gets delayed due to this). Also pls clean the topic after the release of ver 6.0, I don't wanna read about bugs/suggestions already fixed/added.
Did you put the Base.SC2Data in the right folder? $sc2betabase$/Mods/LibertySC2.Mod ?
all i can say is "when?!?" ;D
@skylo $sc2betabase$/Mods/LibertySC2.Mod
is where it shud go?
it always said to any where in "C:\Program Files (x86)\StarCraft II Beta"
just put the SC2date here "C:\Program Files (x86)\StarCraft II Beta\Mods\Liberty.SC2Mod"
yes?
Cant wait for this to release! very excited bout it hopefully it comes before the weekend! Thanks fr all the hard work! 8)
Is it possible to get a ETA on AI 6.0? please <3
To appease the AI gods, I suggest hamster sacrifices. 1,000 should suffice...
My Qs seem to have gotten lost in the convo, so here they are again:
1) Is it conceivable that at some point in time the AI will be able to push with Bunkers, offensively?
2) Can the AI now use warp-in, and is it (potentially) possible to program proxy pylon+warp-in builds?
Cause those'd be fun. ;D
All of Canada is waiting for AI6.0, ETA? I talked to Jeff from Canada this morning and he wants to pass on his thanks for AI5.5 and lower.
Keep up the good work.
AI6.0 > hockey?
ETA?
ETA: Whenever.
Seriously, get a grip, chill, its okay, if it never comes out, its still okay, I'm just saying, please stop spamming asking for ETAs to something that takes time to make.
Quote from: cyricc on March 04, 2010, 08:52:07 PM
ETA: Whenever.
Seriously, get a grip, chill, its okay, if it never comes out, its still okay, I'm just saying, please stop spamming asking for ETAs to something that takes time to make.
ETA for v6.0?
RIP Hamster
i beat 5.5 with AI cheating on easily... pls help!
StarCraft II Beta - Patch 3 (version 0.5.0.14219B)Balance Changes
- TERRAN
- Engineering Bay
- Infantry Armor: The time required for each upgrade has been reduced by 30 seconds, decreasing each upgrade time from 190/220/250 seconds to 160/190/220 seconds.
- Infantry Weapons: The time required for each upgrade has been reduced by 30 seconds, decreasing each upgrade time from 190/220/250 seconds to 160/190/220 seconds.
- Armory
- Vehicle Plating: The time required for each upgrade has been reduced by 30 seconds, decreasing each upgrade time from 190/220/250 seconds to 160/190/220 seconds.
- Vehicle Weapons: The time required for each upgrade has been reduced by 30 seconds, decreasing each upgrade time from 190/220/250 seconds to 160/190/220 seconds.
- Ship Plating: The time required for each upgrade has been reduced by 30 seconds, decreasing each upgrade time from 190/220/250 seconds to 160/190/220 seconds.
- Ship Weapons: The time required for each upgrade has been reduced by 30 seconds, decreasing each upgrade time from 190/220/250 seconds to 160/190/220 seconds.
- PROTOSS
- Zealot
- The maximum shield capacity of this unit has been decreased from 60 to 50.
Bug Fixes
- Fixed a bug where the Infestor's Neural Parasite ability could cause Reapers to lose the ability to move.
- Fixed an issue that could use an incorrect HDR format on some ATI cards.
- Fixed a crash that could happen on some ATI cards.
should we update???
Can somone upload the patch? because i cant install it on mine.
also is ai v6 done?
Quote from: jenkinsdjtg on March 05, 2010, 12:52:41 AM
Can somone upload the patch? because i cant install it on mine.
also is ai v6 done?
why you cant install it??
and what file shoud I upload?? ::)
Quote from: deeptii on March 04, 2010, 11:51:05 PM
i beat 5.5 with AI cheating on easily... pls help!
Lets see you CC rush that cheater verison...
Quote from: turdburgler on March 01, 2010, 08:32:05 PM
Version 6.0 is an almost complete re-write of the blizzard state system as well as the mid and late game for StarCrack AI. This means, we're able to easily write multiple build orders for the various races and control the progression with "triggers" rather than time. On top of this, AI resource code has got a huge overhaul. He now hits the saturation point on all of his towns for both mineral and gas. He can handle is own supplies and defences for all towns. This means we've dropped all the blizzard code for handling this stuff, which is awesome because it sucked. I think I've dropped 100 - 200 lines of blizzard code in this version, all replaced with our custom stuff.
cause when 1st time play v5.5, 1st time i lost on AI T.T, since there is lot script has been change, i will expect fight the AI is like fighting a human... but of course i'm challange the file which is no cheat =D
Say what you want, AI 5.5 non cheating was very stupid. Even the author should admit it - it goes back and forth while you shoot him, he should either fukcing attack till his units die at you but cause you damage or go back and come when he gets 150 limit. He should attack from behind (ok he makes sneaky attacks nice), he should harass workers and build mutalisks and harass workers nto stay at mass Zerglings and Raoches and walk back and forth. If you disagree then you suck.
Quote from: programm on March 05, 2010, 04:21:08 AM
Say what you want, AI 5.5 non cheating was very stupid. Even the author should admit it - it goes back and forth while you shoot him, he should either fukcing attack till his units die at you but cause you damage or go back and come when he gets 150 limit. He should attack from behind (ok he makes sneaky attacks nice), he should harass workers and build mutalisks and harass workers nto stay at mass Zerglings and Raoches and walk back and forth. If you disagree then you suck.
I Disagree.
Quote from: jenkinsdjtg on March 05, 2010, 04:44:11 AM
Quote from: programm on March 05, 2010, 04:21:08 AM
Say what you want, AI 5.5 non cheating was very stupid. Even the author should admit it - it goes back and forth while you shoot him, he should either fukcing attack till his units die at you but cause you damage or go back and come when he gets 150 limit. He should attack from behind (ok he makes sneaky attacks nice), he should harass workers and build mutalisks and harass workers nto stay at mass Zerglings and Raoches and walk back and forth. If you disagree then you suck.
I Disagree.
LAWL @jenkinsdjtg, @programm you post this after the author did admit that the AI had problems, and you also post it as if you have some skill in coding AI. Lets see your work, I wanna see that AI you built with the "mutalisk worker harrassing".
Quote from: cyricc on March 05, 2010, 05:25:21 AM
Quote from: jenkinsdjtg on March 05, 2010, 04:44:11 AM
Quote from: programm on March 05, 2010, 04:21:08 AM
Say what you want, AI 5.5 non cheating was very stupid. Even the author should admit it - it goes back and forth while you shoot him, he should either fukcing attack till his units die at you but cause you damage or go back and come when he gets 150 limit. He should attack from behind (ok he makes sneaky attacks nice), he should harass workers and build mutalisks and harass workers nto stay at mass Zerglings and Raoches and walk back and forth. If you disagree then you suck.
I Disagree.
LAWL @jenkinsdjtg, @programm you post this after the author did admit that the AI had problems, and you also post it as if you have some skill in coding AI. Lets see your work, I wanna see that AI you built with the "mutalisk worker harrassing".
what is that for a stupid comment? what has your own ai coding skill todo with your opinion of the strenth of the current ai?
5.5 cheated ai + chinas mode is pretty good and fun ai, but 5.5 ai alone is crap (but since alot new player here around, its still good for them)
just hope the big hype in the preview post of the new 6.0 ai will met my expectations and the cheated version will be as challenging as 5.5 cheated ai + chines guy mode (macrowise as close as possible)
Quote from: krutoistudent on March 05, 2010, 05:49:01 AM
Quote from: cyricc on March 05, 2010, 05:25:21 AM
Quote from: jenkinsdjtg on March 05, 2010, 04:44:11 AM
Quote from: programm on March 05, 2010, 04:21:08 AM
Say what you want, AI 5.5 non cheating was very stupid. Even the author should admit it - it goes back and forth while you shoot him, he should either fukcing attack till his units die at you but cause you damage or go back and come when he gets 150 limit. He should attack from behind (ok he makes sneaky attacks nice), he should harass workers and build mutalisks and harass workers nto stay at mass Zerglings and Raoches and walk back and forth. If you disagree then you suck.
I Disagree.
LAWL @jenkinsdjtg, @programm you post this after the author did admit that the AI had problems, and you also post it as if you have some skill in coding AI. Lets see your work, I wanna see that AI you built with the "mutalisk worker harrassing".
what is that for a stupid comment? what has your own ai coding skill todo with your opinion of the strenth of the current ai?
5.5 cheated ai + chinas mode is pretty good and fun ai, but 5.5 ai alone is crap (but since alot new player here around, its still good for them)
just hope the big hype in the preview post of the new 6.0 ai will met my expectations and the cheated version will be as challenging as 5.5 cheated ai + chines guy mode (macrowise as close as possible)
Well we all know 5.5 is not good AI, but what did u expect, in few days u cant make good AI. I can only say, good work so far guys, i know at the end AI will be awesome!
Quote from: Bobosmrade on March 05, 2010, 06:04:31 AM
Quote from: krutoistudent on March 05, 2010, 05:49:01 AM
Quote from: cyricc on March 05, 2010, 05:25:21 AM
Quote from: jenkinsdjtg on March 05, 2010, 04:44:11 AM
Quote from: programm on March 05, 2010, 04:21:08 AM
Say what you want, AI 5.5 non cheating was very stupid. Even the author should admit it - it goes back and forth while you shoot him, he should either fukcing attack till his units die at you but cause you damage or go back and come when he gets 150 limit. He should attack from behind (ok he makes sneaky attacks nice), he should harass workers and build mutalisks and harass workers nto stay at mass Zerglings and Raoches and walk back and forth. If you disagree then you suck.
I Disagree.
LAWL @jenkinsdjtg, @programm you post this after the author did admit that the AI had problems, and you also post it as if you have some skill in coding AI. Lets see your work, I wanna see that AI you built with the "mutalisk worker harrassing".
what is that for a stupid comment? what has your own ai coding skill todo with your opinion of the strenth of the current ai?
5.5 cheated ai + chinas mode is pretty good and fun ai, but 5.5 ai alone is crap (but since alot new player here around, its still good for them)
just hope the big hype in the preview post of the new 6.0 ai will met my expectations and the cheated version will be as challenging as 5.5 cheated ai + chines guy mode (macrowise as close as possible)
Well we all know 5.5 is not good AI, but what did u expect, in few days u cant make good AI. I can only say, good work so far guys, i know at the end AI will be awesome!
"If you disagree then you suck." so i disagreed.
I have an idea for you:
instead of working to recreate the IA,
you will it be possible logger all games players
classifying them by score (time, harvest minerals, gas, killed, destroyed building ...)
and to a database,
for your "soft" estimate your level and you put one party to another level of your
easy to say I know,
not so easy to do
I just submitted this idea
well your AI are all in FFA
you have the opportunity to make game (all cpu vs. player ?)
every game ,cpu fight vs cpu ,and very little bit vs me .... (too easy....)
thank you.
the AI in 5.5 is stupid because of the twitchy retreats.
like for example, i can wipe out an entire zerg force using 1 marauder kiting them
Quote from: flatounet on March 05, 2010, 07:58:21 AM
I have an idea for you:
instead of working to recreate the IA,
you will it be possible logger all games players
classifying them by score (time, harvest minerals, gas, killed, destroyed building ...)
and to a database,
for your "soft" estimate your level and you put one party to another level of your
easy to say I know,
not so easy to do
I just submitted this idea
well your AI are all in FFA
you have the opportunity to make game (all cpu vs. player ?)
every game ,cpu fight vs cpu ,and very little bit vs me .... (too easy....)
thank you.
I already suggested this idea in its own thread.
Quote from: DFA on March 05, 2010, 08:55:44 AM
the AI in 5.5 is stupid because of the twitchy retreats.
like for example, i can wipe out an entire zerg force using 1 marauder kiting them
Not if they have Roaches, you can't.
See what I did there? ;)
WE Need This LIKE PRONTO!
Snoop Dogg - Pronto feat. Soulja Boy Tell 'Em (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QVJc25zkRNk#ws)
:P
Quote from: Swarmling on March 05, 2010, 10:48:00 AM
WE Need This LIKE PRONTO!
Snoop Dogg - Pronto feat. Soulja Boy Tell 'Em (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QVJc25zkRNk#ws)
:P
haha yesss
This needs to come out tonight :)! but I'm not getting my hopes up lol
ETA?
CANT WAIT... HEAD EXPLODING! ???
Quote from: Swarmling on March 05, 2010, 10:48:00 AM
WE Need This LIKE PRONTO!
Yes.
Quote from: Swarmling on March 05, 2010, 10:48:00 AM Snoop Dogg - Pronto feat. Soulja Boy Tell 'Em (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QVJc25zkRNk#ws)
:P
No.
Will we getting v6 anytime soon? :\ can you atleast release a 5.6 version or something... :'(
Quote from: andrei030 on March 05, 2010, 01:01:51 PM
Quote from: devinmorris on March 05, 2010, 11:47:20 AM
ETA?
Estimated Time to Arrival.
If you can program 5.5, I think you know what ETA means...
Estimated Time to Arrival?
It's not enough they are giving you all these AI releases, you guys HAVE to know when its coming out? IMO take your time programmers. They didnt have to give us any AI's. So stop demanding a ETA, and by it taking longer than some of the earlier releases you know it will be better. So do yourselves a favor go outside, walk your dog... do something productive or just refresh your f5 key all day like a loser. 8)
Thanks for the hard work fellas
ETA?
To get the topic on something else then constant ETAs
3 new opens, mid and late games for every race.
What does this mean exactly?
Quote from: Dragonly on March 05, 2010, 01:48:09 PM
To get the topic on something else then constant ETAs
3 new opens, mid and late games for every race.
What does this mean exactly?
I think he means that there are 3 different strategies that the computer player will start with (which means you need to scout to counter what his build strategy will be), and then 3 different strats for mid and 3 strats for late game.
Very simply, lots more diversity in how the computer play will play.
Quote from: krutoistudent on March 05, 2010, 05:49:01 AM
what is that for a stupid comment? what has your own ai coding skill todo with your opinion of the strenth of the current ai?
5.5 cheated ai + chinas mode is pretty good and fun ai, but 5.5 ai alone is crap (but since alot new player here around, its still good for them)
just hope the big hype in the preview post of the new 6.0 ai will met my expectations and the cheated version will be as challenging as 5.5 cheated ai + chines guy mode (macrowise as close as possible)
Well I'm simply stating that if you don't have a clue about what you are talking about and all you can do is complain you don't deserve to have an opinion.
DBH..!
Dont Be Haten
SFFN !
Stop Flooding For Nothing :P
Quote from: Cloakedscrotum on March 05, 2010, 01:34:46 PM
It's not enough they are giving you all these AI releases, you guys HAVE to know when its coming out? IMO take your time programmers. They didnt have to give us any AI's. So stop demanding a ETA, and by it taking longer than some of the earlier releases you know it will be better. So do yourselves a favor go outside, walk your dog... do something productive or just refresh your f5 key all day like a loser. 8)
Thanks for the hard work fellas
^^ What he said. ^^
The people making AI don't HAVE to make it for us. So hold onto your panties and take a deep breath. It will be out when it's ready. If you want it sooner, or thinking coding is easy - try it yourself and post your "crazy wicked" AI within 3 days.
Keep up the good work, Turd. Don't let these spoiled brats get you down. ;) (PS I hope you watched those gerbil videos I posted!)
I believe the majority of us (including myself) only say ETA just to anger you type of people. It is funny to watch you get so angry because some random person asked ETA. We may be "trolling" for that but you are only feeding us :)
BTW... ETA?
It would be fun if guys from blizzard would use your AI, or scripts from your AI :) you should post scripts somewhere where they will be safe. (you know, Gnu license etc :P
Quote from: DarkArchon on March 05, 2010, 04:53:21 PM
It would be fun if guys from blizzard would use your AI, or scripts from your AI :) you should post scripts somewhere where they will be safe. (you know, Gnu license etc :P
I very highly doubt it. While turd and others have made great progress in such little time, I can absolutely guarentee Blizzard's AI is vastly superior than these. They have years to work on the AI, as opposed to one week.
Quote from: Gamewiz on March 05, 2010, 04:57:00 PM
Quote from: DarkArchon on March 05, 2010, 04:53:21 PM
It would be fun if guys from blizzard would use your AI, or scripts from your AI :) you should post scripts somewhere where they will be safe. (you know, Gnu license etc :P
I very highly doubt it. While turd and others have made great progress in such little time, I can absolutely guarentee Blizzard's AI is vastly superior than these. They have years to work on the AI, as opposed to one week.
Yeah I heard that you get a feel that you play a human
the fact that the AI scripting language is so open gives me a lot of hope for future development. i think eventually users will be able to make nearly unbeatable AI's that don't cheat at all. Sometimes the world's best chess players have been challenged by playing against a computer AI. I wonder if there will be scripts so advanced that pros will have serious difficulty beating them.
Quote from: sublime on March 05, 2010, 05:02:42 PM
the fact that the AI scripting language is so open gives me a lot of hope for future development. i think eventually users will be able to make nearly unbeatable AI's that don't cheat at all. Sometimes the world's best chess players have been challenged by playing against a computer AI. I wonder if there will be scripts so advanced that pros will have serious difficulty beating them.
could be since it can micro every unit at the same time and macro..
Imagine battle with stalkers where every stalker blinks independently and at the same time attacking 3 of your expansions at the same time
Quote from: iounas on March 05, 2010, 05:11:48 PM
Quote from: sublime on March 05, 2010, 05:02:42 PM
the fact that the AI scripting language is so open gives me a lot of hope for future development. i think eventually users will be able to make nearly unbeatable AI's that don't cheat at all. Sometimes the world's best chess players have been challenged by playing against a computer AI. I wonder if there will be scripts so advanced that pros will have serious difficulty beating them.
could be since it can micro every unit at the same time and macro..
Imagine battle with stalkers where every stalker blinks independently and at the same time attacking 3 of your expansions at the same time
We're doomed... The computers are taking over!!! ??? ??? ??? ???
Quote from: sublime on March 05, 2010, 05:02:42 PM
the fact that the AI scripting language is so open gives me a lot of hope for future development. i think eventually users will be able to make nearly unbeatable AI's that don't cheat at all. Sometimes the world's best chess players have been challenged by playing against a computer AI. I wonder if there will be scripts so advanced that pros will have serious difficulty beating them.
I'm all for unbeatable AI. I always play games on the hardest difficulty modes, ie Street Fighter IV. The challenge makes it more fun.
Quote from: orbb24 on March 05, 2010, 03:58:40 PM
I believe the majority of us (including myself) only say ETA just to anger you type of people. It is funny to watch you get so angry because some random person asked ETA. We may be "trolling" for that but you are only feeding us :)
BTW... ETA?
I'm a Troll Hunter. 6.0 tonight plz. I don't want to play WoW anymore. ET of A?
Quote from: devinmorris on March 05, 2010, 06:01:22 PM
Quote from: orbb24 on March 05, 2010, 03:58:40 PM
I believe the majority of us (including myself) only say ETA just to anger you type of people. It is funny to watch you get so angry because some random person asked ETA. We may be "trolling" for that but you are only feeding us :)
BTW... ETA?
I'm a Troll Hunter. 6.0 tonight plz. I don't want to play WoW anymore. ET of A?
A troll can't be a troll hunter... you cannibal.
But I agree, I hope it comes within the next couple of hours, because I really want to play against a harder AI tonight... I'm getting bored against the ones we have now, as they are not any challenge to me.
What would be really sweet is if they can get an emu bnet server up tonight. I usually have game nights with friends on Fridays. We are itching at getting a chance to destroy each other in SC2. :)
Quote from: jenkinsdjtg on March 05, 2010, 06:50:14 AM
"If you disagree then you suck." so i disagreed.
Congrats! You suck.
No,Im not AI maker but like 1 guy said, what doesn any1s skill has to do with giving a constructive criticism how AI should be? Or are you some flammers here. Well, most seem to be retards if they do not have an idea of a harass. Maybe it isnt that easy to make but maybe the authorn can at least prevent them frm retreating just like hemaybe scripted them to do??
OK well i really like the A.I. its a good little challenge i cant wait to try the new version so that i may improve my abilities since all i do to win as Terran is harass the A.I.'s bases with reapers and soon enough he runs out of minerals and cant rebuild his expansions and i take out the main base with like 20 reapers but OK ??? i would like to c what the A.I. does but i cant access the replay files it says it cant open the map file does anyone know how to fix that
Quote from: turdburgler on March 03, 2010, 09:59:01 PM
Discuss.
how do I get the replays against AI to work it gives me the error message cant open map file
I too can not watch replays it says can not find map???? :-[
Quote from: starscraft-2-fan on March 05, 2010, 07:42:17 PM
Quote from: turdburgler on March 03, 2010, 09:59:01 PM
Discuss.
how do I get the replays against AI to work it gives me the error message cant open map file
i had that problem, the solution is - the AI maps that u put into cache into folder like 00\11 and then renamed the maps to something like 0011desertoasis.
all u have to do is launch the games from that folder with those maps - it should work then
Quote from: devinmorris on March 05, 2010, 06:01:22 PM
Quote from: orbb24 on March 05, 2010, 03:58:40 PM
I believe the majority of us (including myself) only say ETA just to anger you type of people. It is funny to watch you get so angry because some random person asked ETA. We may be "trolling" for that but you are only feeding us :)
BTW... ETA?
I'm a Troll Hunter. 6.0 tonight plz. I don't want to play WoW anymore. ET of A?
I can understand them getting angry when asking for an ETA straight after it was said it is done when it is done. I imagine it can be a bit frustrating making the AI from scratch or just about. Just one mistake, and the map will have no AI players at all in it.
So please... stfu. At most you are getting the people putting so much work into this annoyed and they will just take a break for a few days. I imagine they have been working quite a bit on making the last few Starcrack AI versions this last week.
Also its really annoying seeing how this preview thread gets another page and its nothing but spam. Although I do understand why you are excited about this AI :) Sure sounds awesome. Hope it will be somewhat easy to change the built orders in it, but it seemed okay to work with in the last Starcrack releases, so I guess it will be in 6.0 as well.
Turdburgler locking the main thread? I wonder what this means?! :o
Quote from: turdburgler on March 05, 2010, 09:43:36 PM
Turdburgler locking the main thread? I wonder what this means?! :o
I've been refreshing the page like mad trying to figure our where out posts went and now I think I know what your doing!
IT'S HAPPENING BEFORE MY VERY EYES
gogo turd!
My pants, is jizzed.
Soon I think from what I remmeber in the ICR channel, or maybe I went on late and miss read
UPDATE?
From what I read he's packing it
PACK FASTA pl0x.
OMG if this doesnt come out tonight... My pet PARROT GETS IT!!!!
(http://www.eatonvillenews.net/images/Bob/PET%20PARROT%20%28OP%29%20FEB.%2022,%202007%20P1010027.jpg)
Nice! I was getting far too efficient at smashing this version 5.5 AI!
Quote from: ImWaitingforStarcraft3 on March 05, 2010, 10:33:32 PM
OMG if this doesnt come out tonight... My pet PARROT GETS IT!!!!
Win-win situation. :D
<cocks BB gun and gives parrot the evil eye> >:(
off topic but does anyone know where in the mpq files from the installer one could find the original base.sc2data file?
Quote from: killabyte on March 05, 2010, 10:44:30 PM
off topic but does anyone know where in the mpq files from the installer one could find the original base.sc2data file?
1. Ya, don't do that. Find your own topic to hijack.
2. It's not in an MPQ.
my bad, didn't mean to ask a question others might want to know. instead let's carry on this useful information that this thread is full of.
ass
Quote from: killabyte on March 05, 2010, 10:48:49 PM
my bad, didn't mean to ask a question others might want to know. instead let's carry on this useful information that this thread is full of.
ass
First, I warned people in my introduction I'd likely be an ass. Second, it's not related to the original post or any posts as of recent, so just make your own thread or post in one that better relates to it.
EDIT: Or better yet, use the search function. It's already been said where it is. That little bar up there isn't just there to look pretty.
YEAAH!! it's OUT!!
finally..
thx a lot turd! ;D